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HomeMy WebLinkAbout08.23.10 Work Session Minutes Council Workshop Minutes August 23, 2010 Mayor Larson called the workshop to order at 6:37 p.m. Present: Absent: Also Present: Larson, Donnelly, Fogarty, May, Wilson None Peter Herlofsky, City Administrator; Teresa Walters, Finance Director; Cynthia Muller, Executive Assistant Finance Director Walters explained the City is required to provide a preliminary levy to the County by September 15,2010. If the preliminary levy is not approved on September 7, then a special meeting could be set for September 13,2010. Councilmember May requested an alternate date be chosen rather than September 7, as she will be out of the state. It was suggested to have a decision made so on September 13, only formal approval is required. Also on September 13, a date needs to be set for a public hearing for approval of the final levy on December 6, 2010. Councilmember Fogarty realized a truth-in-taxation hearing is no longer required, but she would like that to be included in the public hearing. Finance Director Walters then gave an update on some information received since the last workshop. She estimated the fiscal disparities distribution to be the same as last year. The City has received information from the County that the fiscal disparities distribution will be $233,973 more than anticipated. At the last workshop it was decided that Councilmembers would submit their suggestions for reducing the budget to the City Administrator and Finance Director. Comments were received from three Councilmembers at the time the packet was put together and a fourth was received afterwards. Comments include: Fire Department: (1 Councilmember) Not replace two positions and keep the members at 50 members ($33,375) (1 Councilmember) Reduce membership level to 47 members. Mayor Larson spoke to the Fire Chief about this and he agreed with reducing the membership by two positions, but does want Council to consider equipment needs that will be coming up soon as far as vehicles and trucks. It will cost a small fortune in a short period oftime. Police Department: (1 Councilmember) Cut down on Police overtime ($10,000). Finance Director Walters estimated this at $10,000 looking at 2009 actual overtime vs. what is budgeted for this year and for 2011. (1 Councilmember) Reduce one of the Police vehicles ($27,000) Legislative: (2 Councilmembers) Eliminate the Metro Cities Dues ($6,340) Administration: City Hall: (1 Councilmember) Mileage ($1,500) (1 Councilmember) Turn ofIlights ($1,250) 17 Council Workshop Minutes August 23, 2010 Page 2 Communications: (1 Councilmember) Solid Waste ($1,000) (1 Councilmember) Reduce postage ($500) Legal: (1 Councilmember) City Attorney ($3,000) IT: (1 Councilmember) Data Processing ($2,400) Engineering: (3 Councilmembers) Reduce services even though the results would mean slower lines ($14,382) Planning: (2 Councilmembers) Reduce services even though the results would mean slower service ($12,703) Natural Resources: (1 Councilmember) ($2,459) Building Inspections: (1 Councilmember) Reduce inspections ($6,169) Park & Rec: (1 Councilmember) Cut down on subscriptions Municipal Services: (3 Councilmembers) Reduce PT employee (offered by Municipal Services Director) ($14,993) (1 Councilmember) Not fill the PT position for seasonal snow plowing. General: (2 Councilmembers) Eliminate a staffposition ($86,949, including benefits) (2 Councilmembers) Re-organize the management staff with the intent to reduce the budget. There were no specifics given except one Councilmember specified that between the two positions it would be about $250,000. Councilmember Wilson stated that was his estimate, but he could be wrong. Councilmember Donnelly had asked if the budget included any retirements. The budget does not include retirements because at the time it was put together we did not have any retirements submitted. There has been one retirement submitted now. The information will be provided at the next Council meeting. City Administrator Herlofsky noted that position being eliminated, will not be 100% of that salary coming from the general fund. Councilmember Donnelly had also asked about the 195th Street project. This project is a cooperative venture between the City, Dakota County and Astra Genstar (developer). Finance Director Walters explained we are receiving $4.5 million from the County. To date we have received $3.5 million. Although we have received the money, it is sitting there waiting to pay the bond payment. We would not need any funds until 2014. At that point, the developer will also be contributing a portion of the bond payment. There are no assessments. The City will have to pay about $200,000/year. Councilmember Wilson asked about the current bond schedule. The total bond payments are $11 million. The principal and interest payment is 18 Council Workshop Minutes August 23,2010 Page 3 $712,338. The developer pays $5.6 million which amounts to $568,870/year. The City pays on this bond until 2023. Councilmember Donnelly asked because he does not want another situation like Vermillion River Crossing. Staff is confident the developer has the means to pay for the development. At the last meeting, staff provided three options for paying the debt service. Two Councilmembers chose option 1 and the rest did not comment. Option 1 shows a levy increase of 11.02%, option 2 shows a levy increase of7.7%, and option 3 shows a levy increase of5.43%. The difference in the options is option 1 pays the debt through the levy, option 2 takes into consideration borrowing funds from another area and paying interest on those funds. Option 3 does the same thing, utilizing the equipment option levy so it has a lower impact on the levy increase. The equipment certificate ends in 2011, so we would continue levying. It would be $462,000 towards the debt. Mayor Larson stated he asked City Administrator Herlofsky what extra it would cost ifwe borrow and what everything would cost. Finance Director Walters stated the interest is about $38,000/year. Mayor Larson asked if the internal borrowing would affect anything else. He wanted to look at not only the interest, but if it would keep us from doing anything. Finance Director Walters explained it depends on where we borrow it from. There are some funds that have reserves for improvements, so those funds could handle it. There are organizations that monitor those funds and if they do not want to lend it, and we had to pull it from the general fund then yes, it would make us go negative even further throughout the year. Mayor Larson had hoped to get options as to how it would affect us. City Administrator Herlofsky explained option 3 shows the breakdown of interest over the period of time, the loan amount, and the amount to be paid back each year including interest. Internal borrowing would not negatively affect the City. Finance Director Walters stated if we borrow the money from an enterprise fund, we should be fme. Ifwe borrow the money from the general fund or any other fund, it will have a negative impact. Councilmember Wilson stated you are basically borrowing from one credit card to pay another and that is the concern he has. It doesn't solve the problem, it shifts it around. City Administrator Herlofsky explained it will not affect the utility funds or enterprise funds. It does affect cash flow. It is $500,000 catching up in the bond levy from this year and next year to cover it. It will still require the Council to levy for it. It does not eliminate the cost, but spreads it out over 10 years. Finance Director Walters added the taxpayers are paying that additional $40,000 in interest. Councilmember Donnelly asked why the City has to pay itself interest. Finance Director Walters explained because it comes from an enterprise fund and an enterprise fund is considered a business. Councilmember Wilson asked why there is an increase in the fiscal disparities. Finance Director Walters stated it is the way they calculated it and Farmington being on the outskirts. The same formula is being used. It could be things have not changed as much here as they have in other communities. Councilmember Wilson also proposed a reduction in Council stipends to the 2009 level. In general he suggested a 5% reduction overall in services which amounts to $433,000. Those reductions would be up to staff At a previous workshop Council was shown a 2% and 5% increase and decrease. He also suggested to outsource the pool. He likes the pool, but we need 19 Council Workshop Minutes August 23, 2010 Page 4 to maximize the revenue. He was also concerned about the viability of the liquor store. Ifthe liquor store is not viable to support the poo~ the arena and park and rec operations, then we have another problem. Finance Director Walters stated the operations of the pool are doing okay. It is the maintenance that costs. Even ifwe were to outsource the operations of the pool, that will not help, because we will still have the maintenance. Councilmember Wilson noted the pool is weather dependent. He asked if it was practical to have it open a couple days a week. City Administrator Herlofsky stated we could miss out on an opportunity because we do close the pool when the weather is not viable. This summer there has been more demand. Councilmember Wilson felt the decision to repair the arena was good, but felt a repair at the pool would not work fmancially. Councilmember Fogarty confirmed with option 1 we are not doing internal borrowing, because there was an explanation that all options include utilizing cash balances from other funds to pay debt payments. Finance Director Walters explained that is not internal borrowing. It is similar to what we are doing with the debt service funds. We levy for it in the year we are paying it, but the payment is due in February and we do not receive tax money until June or July, so we utilize cash balances. Councilmember Fogarty suggested going through the list of cuts. Councilmember May wanted Council to have consensus on the overall principal. There are two fundamental principals, either trying to get it paid and that can be done through the taxpayers or look at serious cuts, or take a softer approach with option 3 where we would extend the debt over 10 years. She wanted to know how other Councilmembers felt about extending the debt or dealing with it upfront. Then it would be how do we deal with it up front; through a levy or through drastic cuts. Mayor Larson felt it would be a combination. He does not like borrowing from funds, but also does not want to tax our way out. We have to talk about serious cuts. Councilmember Wilson asked about the new debt for 2011 for the arena. Finance Director Walters stated we are not levying for the full payment of the arena or the full payment of Walnut Street next year. We are going to levy in the year the payment is due. The payment is due in 2012, so we will levy a portion this year and increase it next year. City Administrator Herlofsky stated the levy for Walnut Street is $75,000 and $20,000 for the arena. The full numbers will appear in 2012. Councilmember Wilson stated the new debt for 2011 is $95,000. Councilmember Donnelly asked with option 1, the levy for the debt and deficit will increase 7.68% in 2011. That does not include the payments for the arena and Walnut Street. That only deals with Vermillion River Crossing, no other debt service funds or operations. Councilmember May asked what the increase will be for 2012 for Walnut Street. Finance Director Walters stated it will go up to $200,419. The arena will increase to $144,120. Councilmember May stated in 2012 we will have an increase of $250,000 and in 2014 we will have an increase of$200,000 for 195th Street. City Administrator Herlofsky noted the increase in the fiscal disparities of$233,973 will help out. That is not reflected in the options as Council has not decided what to do with it. Councilmember Fogarty would like to see the market value homestead credit program eliminated. Councilmember May stated we have to carve that out of the budget permanently. 20 Council Workshop Minutes August 23, 2010 Page 5 Councilmember Fogarty stated it raises our taxes. Mayor Larson noted they still could ask for a check from the City. Councilmember May stated seeing the other increases down the road we need to deal with Vermillion River Crossing issue up front with a much more conservative approach with cuts. As a resident, if faced with a cut in services, she would look to see a combination of cuts in services and try to reduce the taxes. She did not send in her comments. Last year she mentioned specifics and it is a difficult line on whether you are telling management how to do their jobs. Council cannot get too specific, but we cannot get anywhere unless we do. She would like to talk about some reorganization and some real changes. There is a level of disappointment on her end towards staff looking at paper supply cuts and a $1,000 here and there; we are talking about some big numbers. She has never seen any solid proposals for trying to look at the big picture. Whether Council would have adopted drastic changes, she does not know. Councilmember May felt we need to look at reorganization ofthe management staff, look at eliminating rec programs except for a few that are solid in the community, eliminate an SRO, eliminate the canine unit, close the liquor store, no step increases or merit pay, reorganizing ITlHuman Resources and Administrative Services in the management staff She would like to see some good discussion or a presentation from staff We have to tackle this with option 1. Ifwe did not have $500,000 coming in a year or two, maybe it would not be such a looming problem, but we have to get serious about figuring out how to pay these bills. The residents cannot afford it. We do have the highest foreclosure rate in the County and that does have an affect on the community. Finance Director Walters stated that does have an affect on the City as well with deferred taxes and utility bills. Councilmember Wilson recommended a reduction in the total levy of$750,000 from the proposed levy of $9.194 million. He was comfortable levying for the arena and Walnut Street. He agreed we need to solve the problem not only for this year, but the next couple years. He proposed to eliminate the Economic Development Specialist position, reorganize the management staff even if that means eliminating the Human Resources Director position or the Administrative Services Director position; he made it clear he was talking about the positions. We need to figure out a way to run the City leaner than we are. Residents are fine with taking away services, except for Police and Solid Waste. The liquor store is also a concern. He would support reducing Council stipends back to the 2009 level. Ifwe are proposing to eliminate positions, Council needs to do its part. Finance Director Walters clarified Councilmember Wilson mentioned $250,000 in staff and $500,000 would be from the 5%. Councilmember Wilson estimated the positions to be about $250,000, maybe a little less, and the 5% being $440,000 and the stipend reduction being $460 to $470. Even with the increase in the fiscal disparities money, he is not changing his position on the elimination ofthe positions. That will allow us to back down the cuts in services from 5% to 2% or 3%. Mayor Larson agreed. Councilmember May recalled last year there was a discussion about a $50,000 reduction this year and next year and it was left to the discretion of the City Administrator. She asked if that has been done or will be addressed as that was written into the budget for this year. City Administrator Herlofsky stated we had a savings of about $25,000 - $30,000 in not having a Finance Director for the fIrst three months ofthe year, there will also be a difference in salary for the Finance Director that will bring us to $35,000 - $40,000. There will be a retirement by the 21 Council Workshop Minutes August 23,2010 Page 6 end of the year; one third of that is from the general fund, the rest is not. That will help us more in 2011. Councilmember Fogarty wanted to go with option 1. She was not interested in borrowing between funds. She agreed with what Councilmember Wilson has said. She is concerned about the cut in Planning because we have pushed hard for economic development and a 30-day review process to make it easier for businesses to come. We cannot have them getting hung up in Planning. Ifplats come in, she did not want it to get stuck at City Hall. Reductions in building inspections, maybe someone has to wait a couple days for a deck inspection; she was okay with that. She was not okay with a commercial developer having to wait three extra weeks to get a plat. She would rather spend the $12,000 and raise taxes $12,000. Councilmember Wilson stated he liked the number the 5% reduction brought us to. He did not see the 5% in each department being important. His proposal was a $750,000 reduction and those were the categories he felt it could come from. Councilmember Fogarty felt Council all agreed with option 1. The biggest thing is she would like to put in place a Council budgeting policy. What happened in Hill Dee was inexcusable. She was not aware through the budget process last year that it was not being levied for. It was not brought to her attention that we were getting pre- payments and they were not applied to the principle. Finance Director Walters clarified the pre- payments did not go to the general fund, they went to the debt service fund. Instead of levying to pay the debt, we used those pre-payments to bring the levy down. Then we did not increase the levy again. Councilmember Fogarty stated she would rather continue to levy what we need to levy and pay down the principle. She knew about Vermillion River Crossing, but had no idea for Hill Dee we were not levying what we needed to levy. She would like to create an internal policy as a result of what happened in the budget and it will address things coming up in the future. Councilmember Wilson gave a lot of credit to Finance Director Walters for scouring the budget in a way the previous Finance Director didn't. You have to be able to trust your Finance Director with all the information. He really appreciated that they can trust she is giving information that is reliable. Councilmember Fogarty agreed. Mayor Larson added she will tell us how it is. Councilmember Wilson stated we can create a policy, but if it happens again, what do we do. Councilmember Donnelly stated ifwe eliminate the SRO, that will cost the City money. Ifwe want to save money in the Police, then we should eliminate an Officer. Ifhe would have known we were in this situation, he would not have replaced Ted Dau. Councilmember May stated there is no department that should not be looked at. The reason we are in this situation is not because of reckless hiring of staff, it is because of Vermillion River Crossing and the bond payments. Now we have to make drastic cuts. Councilmember Donnelly asked for a clarification ofCouncilmember Wilson's suggestions. Councilmember Wilson suggested cutting $750,000 from the $9.1 million. Now that we have the fiscal disparities, his recommendation would be to cut about $510,000 off the full proposed levy. Within that he wants to recognize the fact we have new debt that Council supported with the arena and Walnut Street. Councilmember Fogarty stated we are trying to come to a number for the preliminary levy. She proposed taking the $9.194 levy number and reduce it by $400,000. Staff should bring that back and also reducing it by $510,000 showing where the cuts would come, and taking Council suggestions, to give Council a number for the preliminary levy. The preliminary levy would be 22 Council Workshop Minutes August 23,2010 Page 7 $8,794,955 with a $400,000 reduction. She wanted to see both options because she was interested in exploring the Deputy Registrar. Councilmember Donnelly clarified this does not include the $233,000 in fiscal disparities. We are talking about $400,000 in real cuts. Finance Director Walters stated we could reduce the levy on the 2006A bond (Vermillion River Crossing) by the $233,000. She clarified the $400,000 is coming from Council suggestions. Mayor Larson stated it is coming from the 3% cut across the board. Councilmember Fogarty stated this is putting it back on the City Administrator and Finance Director. This is the amount, you have gotten our recommendations, take that and bring it back. She would like to see a budget that includes the Deputy Registrar and does not include the Deputy Registrar with a $400,000 and $500,000 reduction. She wants to know what those cuts mean. She would like to see this after the preliminary levy is adopted; so for the September workshop. Councilmember Wilson asked ifher recommendation includes the staff reductions he proposed. Councilmember Fogarty replied yes and no. This is where we hand it back to staff. They know what staff reductions work. They have been given information to incorporate into the budget. Maybe the City Administrator will say he can live without this staff member vs. this staff member. It gives him some flexibility. He has heard a clear message of what positions we would like him to look at. Councilmember Wilson stated 15 minutes ago Councilmember Fogarty supported it, now we are down from $750,000 to $400,000. Councilmember Fogarty stated they are still on the same page; she wants a $100,000 cushion to look at the Deputy Registrar. Councilmember Donnelly stated we cannot do anything about the debt levy. We have $2.8 million (in debt levy) we cannot touch. We have $6.3 million for a proposed general levy. What has been said is that we want that to be under $6 million; so take $400,000 off the $6.3 million. That is more than 5% of that number. City Administrator Herlofsky stated Council has also asked for the 2% - 5% discussed previously. Councilmember Fogarty stated there is an assumption in her saying that, that there will be staff reductions. This cannot be done without staff reductions. Councilmember Donnelly was in favor of option 1. City Administrator Herlofsky stated the $233,000 applied to the Vermillion River Crossing bond will make things easier for 2012. Councilmember Fogarty realized there is future debt coming, but there are also opportunities that may present themselves. Things will happen at Vermillion River Crossing and that may make the debt better. Councilmember Wilson went over the numbers again. He originally wanted $750,000 taken from the $9,194,955 which would bring us to a levy of$8.4 million. It seems we are taking the $233,000 and giving it back to the City. Councilmember Fogarty clarified it will reduce the $713,000 bond amount. Councilmember Wilson wants to see $750,000 in real cuts. Councilmember Fogarty was looking at the $6.386 million to be under $6 million. Finance Director Walters stated ifwe use the $500,000 reduction and take into consideration the fiscal disparities, we are going to reduce the overall levy by $733,000. Mayor Larson also agreed with option 1. He was in favor of, and it will have to happen, some staff reductions and it will mean a department head. He wants the $6,386,622 general levy to be under $6 million, he would be in favor of keeping the canine unit, he does not want to do anything drastic with the liquor store. We should look at that enterprise fund at the end of the year as a bottom line and maybe it is a management decision we have to make. He was in favor of keeping the rec programs the way they are as they are important to the community, and keep 23 Council Workshop Minutes August 23, 2010 Page 8 the SRO. Councilmember Wilson did agree with keeping the liquor stores. We cannot tax our way out of things; we have to cut. City Administrator Herlofsky stated it is retail and does provide us with $200,000 a year in the general fund and some other funds. He would be reluctant to eliminate it. It could be management improving or the location of the stores. Councilmember Wilson asked ifwe are resolving this on September 13. Councilmember Fogarty stated ifwe can give staff direction tonight, it will give them more time accomplish what they need to do. Council agreed with seeing a $400,000 and $500,000 reduction. Ifwe need to have more discussion, then she does not want to wait until September 13. Councilmember Donnelly clarified we are going to accept the number no matter what it does. City Administrator Herlofsky stated no budget decisions have to be made to send the number to the County. Councilmember Donnelly stated Council still needs to have an idea as to how we will achieve that number. City Administrator Herlofsky noted we have from September - December to work that out. Mayor Larson stated he wanted staff to bring back a levy for a $400,000 and $500,000 reduction. City Administrator Herlofsky suggested using the $400,000 for a higher preliminary levy. Further work can be done to lower it. Councilmember Wilson wanted to target the preliminary levy discussion for the September 7, meeting so the public understands what we are talking about and vote on it on September 13. It could be an item on the agenda and take public comment. Unless we chose to televise the meeting on September 13, he would like to have it transparent so everyone can see what is going on. Councilmember Fogarty was uncomfortable waiting until September 13. City Administrator Herlofsky noted we do have a parks tour workshop on August 30, but that can change. Councilmember Wilson felt Council was at a consensus and did not know what controversy could come up. Councilmember Fogarty stated then we could approve it on September 7. Councilmember May stated she would be comfortable with the preliminary number. Councilmember Wilson agreed; as long as they see both $400,000 and $500,000 reductions. The next discussion will be at the regular Council meeting on September 7,2010. City Administrator Herlofsky would like some time to work on this and if information is available early, he will get that to Council. Mr. Jerry Ristow was concerned with the fiscal disparities and that now the County is handling it as it used to be the State. Staff clarified the County has informed staff ofthe State's decision. Mr. Ristow asked what commercial buildings we have that this fiscal disparities money came from. City Administrator Herlofsky explained it is from other areas in the State where development has taken place. Mr. Ristow cautioned Council has been told they would be receiving money before and it never came. Mr. Colin Garvey stated he brought this to Council last fall. His taxes jumped $1200 in one year. It is not a great thing for business owners. You want to bring in business, fiscal disparities jumps every year and it comes from the business owners. That is a former tax. You keep raising it, you will not get anyone to come here. Finance Director Walters stated the City does not set fiscal disparities. It does come from the business owners, but we are actually getting more than what our business owners contribute. Mr. Garvey was told cities do have input on it. City Administrator Herlofsky stated wherever development occurs, only a portion stays in that local community. The rest is shared by the metro area so we get a share of everyone's development. Mr. Garvey stated his biggest increase in fiscal disparities was from this year to last year. Now he will get another increase. City Administrator Herlofsky stated fiscal disparities is not on the 24 Council Workshop Minutes August 23,2010 Page 9 tax statement. Mr. Garvey stated fiscal disparities is on the tax statement, that is why he brought it to Council last fall. Mr. David Pritzlaffnoted Council has proposed some cuts and we have one gentleman saying this is not going to be fun and make people happy. That is not the job that person is required to do. He felt the gentleman has to follow Council direction. Life it not always fun and happy. Regarding the land the City owns, he proposed the City get rid of some land; we have way too much land we have no use for and get it back on the tax roles. Mayor Larson asked what deals we have lost. Mr. Pritzlaff asked if the old parks garage has been sold. It has and the owner is fmishing the interior design plans; the old Rambling River Center is in the process of being sold. Mr. Pritzlaff stated he has previously brought up the development on 195th Street, in that agreement what has not been recognized here is that if they do not make their bond payments, the City has the right to take land from that developer. He recalled he and another Councilmember fought to have that in the agreement to be able to take the land from the developer as collateral and sell it. He wanted to make sure Council knows that is in the contract. As far as reducing inspections, he spoke with City Engineer Schorzman who explained most of their cost is fuel. Mr. Pritzlaff proposed categorizing the City into different areas for each day of the week. When people pick up their permits, tell them which area of the City they inspect on a certain day. Mayor Larson liked that suggestion. Mr. Pritzlaff also asked that the trail agreement along Pilot Knob be reconsidered rather than spending $28,000. Councilmember Donnelly stated we have already signed the contract for the trail and it would not help the general fund. Mr. Tim Thompson stated regarding the staffpositions, it sounds like they will re-organize staff which is understandable. Secondly with Police, where have we shown we are profitable with our DOT vehicles and officers. Where is it shown the money that has been spent and that we have been profitable. Mayor Larson stated we are not. Mr. Thompson stated it was brought up to cut the SRO, why was nothing brought up about the DOT officer. Ifwe have an expenditure that will not make a dollar, why not look at that. There is a Tahoe, scales, and a trained officer. Councilmember Fogarty stated to say it is a DOT position is not accurate. Mr. Thompson stated he has customers in Dakota County, Rice County, and Goodhue County. Two of them spent three hours and 15 minutes in the high school parking lot with an officer. When they left they had a ticket for $115. That officer was there for three hours and 15 minutes; it is not a profitable deal. They will not drive through Farmington again and will reroute all their people. Mayor Larson directed staff to look into that. Mr. Thompson asked if the City was charged by the school when using the facility for the DOT training. He was in charge of youth football for five years and was charged $250 a day to use the sidewalk at FES. The City is wasting money hand over fist with the department. You are paying money to use that parking lot. It needs to be looked at because it is $100,000 plus a year going out the window from the asset to the people to the manpower. The answer to the liquor store is location. You can put anyone in there to manage it. If you cannot afford the lease and you cannot afford to get anyone in it you will never get any liquor sold. City Administrator Herlofsky stated we are not losing money; we are not making as much as we would like. Mr. Thompson stated you are not making as much because you are not getting the traffic. City Administrator Herlofsky stated there is two years left on the lease and we are looking at options. Mr. Thompson stated if you close the poo~ then you will be back to adding more Police Officers. You have a facility that is taking care of kids. There is 25 Council Workshop Minutes August 23, 2010 Page 10 nothing in town for kids 8-15 years of age. If you would show some effort for it, you may not have any problems. He understood the pool is a losing battle from day one, but does not understand why you would want to take away one of the last things teenagers have in this town. You either need to manage it better, repair it with donated money, or somewhere along the line get it done. Mr. Thompson is a fIrm believer in cutting services; you have to cut services. He believed sanitation should be privatized because we are the only ones in several counties around that are doing it. If the City is making money on it then you are overcharging us. He cannot control his taxes, but he can control the amount of waste from his home. If you privatize it, the City will save money in the general fund and you can reduce it by a 35% cut rather than 40% and save the dollar issues for several years. It also belongs to the people that pay the bill anyway. It is up to the individual that has the waste to pay the bill. You pay for the amount of waste you are putting out. If it is profItable, then the City is overcharging. He believed it is a service. It needs to be privatized and it would save the City a ton of money. Councilmember Wilson agreed with Mr. Thompson's comments about the pool. He does not support closing the pool, but we need to explore how we can do things differently. Mr. Thompson stated there has to be something in town for teenage kids. Councilmember Wilson recalled we did discuss blending a teen center with the senior center and that has gone off the radar. Ms. Patti Norman, stated she has run pools for 10-15 years and is a Certified Pool Operator and used to work for the City. There is a difference between essential services for the City and services that are necessary. Keeping a pool open is a place for kids to go, especially in that age of8-15; there is a lot of unstructured time. Statistically you will fmd higher instances of juvenile delinquency, vandalism and problems within the City ifkids do not have a place to go. If you give kids an opportunity to go there and socialize instead of just watching TV and playing video games, you will fmd there will be a drop in problems. There are studies showing a place to go is a positive influence on kids. It is also a positive influence on obesity issues. If you want to put a value on it, you have to put a value on what is necessary for the City to keep our kids happy and families healthy. It will be hard to put a dollar value on it, but you have to take the plunge and say this is good for the community. Mr. Jerry Ristow agreed. He lives by the pool and it is used a lot. It would be a bad choice to close the pool. Councilmember Fogarty stated we are not going to close the pool. There is no support to close the pool. Mr. Thompson stated he agreed, but every time Council comes to the budget you get reminded by the City Administrator the age of the pool, the maintenance and no one has come up with the dollars to fIx it. It needs repair, but someone also needs to take responsibility to come up with a dollar factor on when the pool will be repaired in the future. MOTION by Fogarty, second by Wilson to adjourn at 8:27 p.m. APIF, MOTION CARRIED. Respectfully submitted, Cynthia Muller Executive Assistant 26