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HomeMy WebLinkAbout08.11.08 Work Session Minutes City Council Workshop Minutes August 11, 2008 Mayor Soderberg called the workshop to order at 6:30 p.m. Present: Soderberg, Fogarty, McKnight, Pritzlaff, Wilson Also Present: Peter Herlofsky, City Administrator; Lisa Shadick, Administrative Services Director; Tina Hansmeier, Economic Development Specialist; Cynthia Muller, Executive Assistant Audience: Charlie and Joanne Weber, Kris Akin, Leon Orr, Kathryn Akin, Blanche Reichert, Ed Samuelson, Gil Anderson, Marilyn Briesacher, Tim Burke, Patti Norman, Colin Garvey, Allen Koss, Dave McMillen MOTION by Pritzlaff, second by Wilson to approve the agenda. APIF, MOTION CARRIED. Mayor Soderberg asked for comments from the residents on the use of the current City Hall site. Ms. Blanche Reichert, 113 Oak Street, member of the Rambling River Center, felt this was an excellent location for a Senior Center/Teen Center. There is lots of parking and space. Some walls would have to be re-arranged. Teens need a place to go as they are all over downtown after 9:00 p.m. There is vandalism, they throw garbage in the Depot Way Arts Park and then the City has to pick it up and residents pay for it. At the current Rambling River Center there is not terrific parking, and with the new City Hall, parking for seniors will be impossible. She feels the Rambling River Center should be torn down and made into a parking lot. The foundation is crumbling. She has heard some people want the current City Hall site to be a Vets Memorial park. To have a memorial for the vets is a terrific idea, but she does not think this is the spot for it. It needs to be in the Rambling River Park along the road, so when people drive through town they can see the memorial for the vets and remember them. Northfield has a terrific memorial on TH3. If the memorial is on the City Hall site, she feels it will become a skate board park after 10:00 p.m. Mr. Leon Orr, 19161 Echo Lane, Chairperson of the Farmington Area Veteran's Memorial Committee, stated the Farmington area veterans have been trying to locate a memorial since 1925. They were actively looking for a place when they were informed there was a possibility that one of the considerations for the current City Hall site was the City might develop a downtown park and would they be interested in being a part of that downtown park with a Veteran's Memorial if that is the direction Council took. Members of the committee evaluated several sites; current City Hall site, north of the current City Hall, Rambling River Park, Dakota County Fairgrounds, Vermillion River Crossings, and the future Farmington North Community Park. They assigned points based on public visibility, adequate size, availability, convenient parking, routinely available to people, easily developed, utilities available, shared with other public facilities, and historically appropriate. After evaluating the sites, the current City Hall location was the first choice, the second choice was north of the current City Hall in some type of redevelopment effort, and the third choice was Rambling River Park, then Dakota County Fairgrounds, Vermillion River Crossings, and Farmington North Community Park. Whether this site is chosen for a downtown park or not, the committee is clear their first choice for a memorial 1-13 Council Workshop Minutes August 11, 2008 Page 2 would be in the downtown area for several reasons. When recognizing veterans of many, many decades past up to the present, that by itself is historical by nature. In the historical downtown they felt this would be appropriate. As far as visibility, they want it to not just be visible, but easily accessible in a passive manner. Rambling River Park is more of an active park. This is more of a reflective, quiet type of memorial. Council was given a drawing a month ago of what the committee developed. That would be the concept phase and next would be the detail design. The actual dedicated space for the memorial takes 20% of the space for the downtown park. During certain veterans activities, the public would use the whole park for a veteran's event. Mr. Orr has visited memorials in various parts of the country. The Northfield memorial is a very nice facility. It is visible from the highway, but is more of a passing visibility as opposed to convenient access by the public. The proposed memorial contains a waterfall to drown out ambient noises in general. One resident asked what the rest of the park would be like. Mr.Orr noted that would be up to the City to determine. Mr. Orr envisioned a historical park. In their drawings, they show a shelter modeled after the railroad depot. Mr. Ed Samuelson, asked what the original cost was of the current City Hall. He asked if a feasibility study has been done on the building. City Administrator Herlofsky stated there was one done when a new City Hall was considered to determine if there was sufficient reason to spend money on this building. Councilmember Fogarty recalled it was more to evaluate whether a new City Hall should be built or whether this building could be built up and it could not, or if it could be expanded, and inefficiencies of the building. She was not sure if a study for different types of uses has been done. Mr. Samuelson asked if Council would consider having a feasibility study done before they make a decision on this building. Mayor Soderberg felt a feasibility study has an end goal in mind. City Administrator Herlofsky stated staffhas received some numbers to make it useful, but there was not a specific purpose designed for the building. It is difficult to say what you can do unless you first decide what you will do with it. There are heating and cooling issues. Mr. Samuelson understood the City needs to retain ownership of the land because of the well. Mayor Soderberg stated it makes it difficult to sell the parcel because of the well. City Administrator Herlofsky stated the City has to have control of 50 ft. surrounding the well and that cuts into portions of the building. Mr. Samuelson asked if Council has a timeline for their decision and if it would be this Council making the decision or a future Council. Mayor Soderberg replied it has not been determined. Mr. Samuelson has heard about a possible park and recreation referendum being proposed in the future. He asked if funding for this potential would be part of that and if there is a timeline. Mayor Soderberg stated that has not been determined. Councilmember Pritzlaff asked staff to obtain the appraised value of this building the way it is now. Mr. Oil Anderson, 713 Spruce Street, is a member of the American Legion, and is in favor of having a nice memorial. However, it has to be something visible. He does not think the current City Hall site is visible. Something at the Rambling River Park, children will ask questions about it and they want to get the kids involved. Mr. Anderson is also on the Rambling River Center Board and they would like to use the current City Hall building. It was originally built for the youth as a Community Center. He felt they would be missing the boat to not trade the current Rambling River Center for this building looking at the outside structure, the foundation, the heating, the square footage, etc. A parking lot at the current Rambling River Center site would be useful for the new City Hall. Parking is a big issue when anything is going on. 1-14 Council Workshop Minutes August II, 2008 Page 3 Ms. Kris Akin, owner of 302 Oak Street, was a business owner for 20 years in downtown Farmington, there have been surveys done by the City and the Chamber asking residents what they would like to see in the community. One thing that has been brought up many times is a Teen Center. There are lots of outdoor programs, but not so many indoor programs. If the Parks and Recreation Department does not want to do it, then rent it to the YMCA, or someone who will do something indoors for kids. As a downtown business owner there is a problem with teens downtown. She would be mortified if they had a memorial downtown that was defaced or that was treated disrespectfully. She believes the memorial should be at Rambling River Park because it is a showcase of the community. When talking to other people, what they remember about Farmington is the beautiful park and the river. If the City were to rent the building, she does not consider it competition as a building owner. She considers it good competition to help get other businesses with more people coming and going so if the City decides to rent this building to other businesses, offices, retail, it is not competition. It is good for the downtown. Farmington needs an adult daycare, so if a Senior Center or a Teen Center was located here, that would work well with an adult daycare situation. We have the nursing home, the community home health, but we do not have an adult daycare where you can drop off a person for respite care during the day. That is another type of business Farmington needs. Ms. Marilyn Briesacher, member of the Rambling River Center, stated since she has been on the board she realizes how much they are outgrowing the space. One of their goals is to be a resource to the community. We cannot provide some of the services because we do not have the room. There are a lot of things going on at the same time such as card playing, line dancing, they are interacting and the noise gets to be an issue. The parking is a big issue. There were only two days out of all of last year that the facility was not being used. They provide space for 4-H, Girl Scouts, churches, receptions, AA meetings, Alanon meetings. There are senior programs consisting of card playing, organ club, model train club, computer classes, use of the computers for seniors, line dancing, yoga, men's coffee group, fitness center, wood carving. For non-members there is also the day old bread program, blood pressure checks, happy feet, 55 Alive classes, senior food for health program, and CAP dining. With all these things going on, they could use the space of a larger facility and be a resource for the community they would like to be. Mr. Charlie Weber, 5220 Robin Lane, member of the Rambling River Center Board and the Parks and Recreation Commission, noted there is a lot of talk about what it will take to upgrade this building. He had a copy of the estimates and there are a couple things he wanted to point out. One is the demolition ofthe existing building is $210,000. It does not say anything about fixing the ground the building sits on after it is torn down. You do not build a park for 50 cents. All of the things noted such as heating, etc. they have the same problem if not worse, at the Rambling River Center today. They have two furnaces, one does not have an air conditioner and the one that is there does not keep up. This is an excellent opportunity for this to be a community project for the young and old to work together in making these changes. In the past the Rambling River Center has put things in the budget that most of the time were turned down and the seniors raised the money with the help of the community to fix those things. Mr. Tim Burke, 20087 Heathrow Way, did not have anything to add about what the potential use of this building might be, but they have heard a lot of potentially very good uses of this building. I think it would be a horrible waste to knock this building down. The things we want to 1-15 Council Workshop Minutes August 11, 2008 Page 4 accomplish here can be accomplished in other places where we do not have to destroy a perfectly good and functional building. Across the block is an open lot that the Council and EDA have been struggling with for a long time to try and put a building there. We have a perfectly good building here and some people want to knock it down. If the issue is where do we want to put a memorial, there are other excellent opportunities. He liked the idea of the memorial being at Rambling River Park where there is more green space and more space to conduct activities around it and gather. Having a resource like this and doing away with it would be a terrible waste of resources in this community that we would come to regret in very short order. Mr. Colin Garvey, asked when it was decided the well house could not be split. He believed there was a study done in 2003, 2004 and there was a task force. He was personally called and asked if he was interested in buying the City Hall. They were going to put this up for sale and thought they could get $583,000 for it. That was the reason for choosing the new site, was because the well house could be split off. He asked where it was changed that it could not be split. Mayor Soderberg did not know that it had been changed, but you still have to control 50 ft. around the well site. Mr. Garvey understood that, but he heard earlier that it was just about impossible, and that is not what was said four years ago. Mayor Soderberg stated it makes the site less desirable. Mr. Garvey feels the current City Hall should be put up for sale and the money could be used to remodel the old Senior Center and buy the building next to it. There are enough spaces sitting in town and the rest of the business community is struggling. Every project there are assessments and values are going down, businesses are leaving. There is too much space sitting already. To tear this down to have another space, he cannot believe they are even thinking about it. At the worst, a Senior Center/Teen Center makes good sense. He was here in 2005 when the Veteran's Memorial people came to town and Rambling River Park was their first choice. That seems to be changed also. The use of this building has changed quite a bit since the original task force came up with a City Hall site. He felt it should be put up for sale and start reducing some of the taxes. Ms. Kris Akin suggested moving the liquor store to the current City Hall site if the City will be retaining ownership of the building. Mr. Ed Samuelson asked ifthe school district has expressed any interest in the building. They have not. Mr. Allen Koss, 1032 I st Street, asked what the procedure will be now. Mayor Soderberg replied Council will take the input received, along with the estimates staff has received from the architect, get answers to some of the questions regarding the original cost, and any earlier studies. This information will be compiled and somewhere in the future there will be another workshop to discuss it. Mr. Koss stated they receive a lot of communication from the City. He suggested polling the City population with a tear out in a mailing such as the water bill or the newsletter, list the suggestions offered, and see what people think. The kids have nothing to do at night. He has watched them set fires along the railroad tracks, put objects on the railroad tracks to be hit by the train, they have nothing else to do. St. Michael's Church has to be used as a community building, as Farmington does not have a community building. He felt this would be an ideal spot. Mr. Dave McMillen, 19440 Elsmere Court, appreciated the City and the Veteran's Memorial Committee looking into the memorial. Wherever it goes is fine, but to use this building as a 1-16 Council Workshop Minutes August II, 2008 Page 5 Senior Center is the right thing to do. The seniors as well as the teens are an asset to this community and we need to look out for them. He uses the current Rambling River Center once a month as a member ofthe model railroad club. It gets brutally hot and noisy, and for the seniors that use that building everyday, it is nice they have a place, but this building with the heating and air conditioning fixed, would provide a more secure, user friendly space for seniors. We have to keep these people in mind. They are an asset to the community. Mr. Tim Burke noted Council mentioned there was an estimate on the cost of doing something with this building. He asked what the Council was going to do, because he thought just like a feasibility study, unless you know how you intend to use it, getting a cost estimate is a waste of time, unless it is purely mechanical. Mayor Soderberg stated that is what the estimates were. Mr. Burke would like to know the source of the estimates and what they actually are and suggested staff put them on the website. City Administrator Herlofsky stated any estimate without a specific purpose is a guess and that is what was provided. It was technical based on the heating and cooling to give us some indication. Ms. Kris Akin assumed when Council makes a decision they will have an estimate for the current Rambling River Center building of what that will cost to maintain it or sell it. Mayor Soderberg stated we would have that information by what it has cost us in the past and estimates for upgrades or improvements. As the improvements are identified there will be studies done to determine the cost. City Administrator Herlofsky stated the Council in good faith is looking for suggestions so the efforts will bring the community together and not create division. The purpose is to get as much good information as possible. Councilmember Wilson noted some residents have mentioned a Senior Center/Teen Center. He asked if they can work well together. Mr. Charlie Weber stated Prior Lake has one. It works well because the seniors take their nap at 3:00 p.m. and the kids get up at 3:00 p.m. Ms. Blanche Reichert stated there would have to be a Teen Board with the Senior Board and some supervision. We have to get the kids involved with community things. Mr. Colin Garvey stated this was all looked at when the City Hall site was chosen. At that time it was decided to put this building up for sale. He asked when that changed. It was supposed to be sold to pay down the debt. Mayor Soderberg was not aware that it was decided, it was discussed. Councilmember Pritzlaff thought the estimate for fixing this building was high and thought all those improvements had to be made. He found out that is not the case. Whatever is on the list as far as what can be done to upgrade the building, just because we change the use, all of that does not have to be done. City Administrator Herlofsky stated until we decide a use, it is hard to determine which of them will have to be done. If the Senior Center/Teen Center is the consensus, what timeframe are we looking at? We move into the new City Hall next month, he does not envision this building being empty 3-5 months before a decision is made. Mayor Soderberg stated we have not determined any timelines. The only thing we know is that we move into the new building August 25, 2008. Then it will be up to Council to determine the time line. A resident noted when Council was discussing building the Community Center in northern Farmington, it was a combined building for seniors, kids, activities, ball park. When that study 1-17 Council Workshop Minutes August II, 2008 Page 6 was done, there was a lot of money spent on that. We could not afford to build it at this time, so how can we afford to tear down a building we have. Ms. Kris Akin stated with the Downtown Business Association planning events, she felt a Farmers Market would be nice in this area. They are doing quarterly events. Whatever Council decides, make it quick. Don't let it sit empty. That is what hurts people trying to rent and sell buildings. Councilmember McKnight stated he has heard from plenty of people before tonight and it is also his preference to look at what it would take to turn this into a Senior Center. Everything does not have to happen over night. He would have no problem asking Rambling River Center staff, Missie, Peter, and staff to look at this building and what it would take to move in a month or two after we are in the new City Hall. Turning it into a Senior Center is his first preference. Councilmember Fogarty felt a Senior Center/Teen Center is a great use for this building. She would like to hear more about what Prior Lake is doing. She does not want this building sitting empty. We should have had this conversation six months ago so that we could be converting this in a month, but that did not happen. We do not need a long drawn out discussion if we have a consensus of what we want done. If obstacles become impossible then we will have to re- evaluate. It seems the majority of Council is leaning towards a concept and if that is what we are going with, let's dive in and see what it will take and what we need. Let's find out how Prior Lake works theirs so we don't re-invent the wheel. Councilmember Wilson suggested forming a short time ad hoc committee with one or two Councilmembers, members of the Rambling River Center Board, teen advocates and have three or four meetings to come up with a recommendation. Councilmember Fogarty agreed. Councilmember Pritzlaff stated he was in favor of the Senior Center/Teen Center. The parking in the downtown has been a problem, but that is not his biggest concern. Sometimes things cannot be done overnight, but if it becomes a Senior Center he would like to see it within a month. MOTION by Fogarty, second by McKnight to adjourn at 7:20 p.m. APIF, MOTION CARRIED. Respectfully submitted, ~~ J~7~7~~ 13;nthia Muller Executive Assistant 1-18